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Help - DIY with B110/T27

 
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aspe
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Joined: 07 Nov 2005
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2005 10:43 pm    Post subject: Help - DIY with B110/T27 Reply with quote

Hi! I'm new to this Forum and I would like some advice conc. my KEF speakers.
In the 70-ties I built the speakers I've had since that (!). I think I bought a KEF kit - consisting of B110 (SP1003), T27 (6535 I believe) and a DN13 SP1015 crossover. The speaker design was my own - a floorstanding box with sloped baffle to fit my student's room (cabinet datas were taken from the Coda).

Now - one of the xovers is not working and my room is bigger, thus I would like to do something about it.

I still want a floorstanding design - about 80 cm high and slim as possible.
I want it to produce best bass as possible (response and depth - I know the limits of a small woofer like the B110) in a 3x4 meter room.
An integrated ss.amp. of 60-100 W will be used.
I listen to all kind of music, but prefer vocal/guitar/modern music.

Any suggestions conc:
- the cabinet design (closed system the only way with B110?)
- new crossover (is SP1015 really the right config.?)

Thanks!
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harry h
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Location: Kapiti coast. New Zealand

PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 9:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

re cab design, I personally would be looking at a T-Line design for best bass response.For a fs of 35hz a folded line of 1.95m should do the trick nicely.
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ColinR
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 08, 2005 11:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
new crossover (is SP1015 really the right config.?)



I'd steal the bass section of the crossover circuit from the Daline on the links page or Constructor CS1A from the documents page and use the Bessel circuit normally used with a T27 6535 + 5uF, +0.25mH-,+ 5uF+.
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aspe
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2005 7:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Colin!
I'm not very familiar with the different crossover that could be used (nor am I good in the electronics) - could you be more specific about the design of your suggested crossover (that with the Bessel and the modding)

The Daline looks very interesting (however the drawing in the article about it is very blurred, can't really read the dimensions).

(I have already been fancying a Daline with double B110:s to move more air (pars available on ebay) - wonder how that could be utilized ...)

I don't know why I got that intersted about my KEF units and a new project with these ...
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ColinR
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2005 8:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
be more specific about the design of your suggested crossover


With the Daline draw a vertical line upwards from the 3kHz on the description of the schematic (b). Components to the left of this line are for the bass unit.
With the CS1A ignore all the components below (and including) R4.

A Bessel for a T27 is pictured in the T27 6535's data sheet and consists of + 5uf 0.25mH+to- and 5uF+ to drive unit.
The components are arranged in the shape of the letter T, hence t-section.

The "normal" filter for a T27 SP1032 is an acoustic Butterworth consisting of four capacitors an inductor and a resistor to compensate for the units' rising response with frequency and will somewhat kill the output of the lugubrious 6535.

You'll have to email me directly regarding specific Daline dimensions, as I've got that issue of Hi-Fi News Very Happy .
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aspe
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2005 7:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Colin, I think the xover is clear to me now.

Wonder how Harry came up with the folded line of 1.95m ...
For a B110 TL, 1/4 of wavelenght is a little bit more, isn't it?
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ColinR
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 12:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think he's taken the speed of sound as 300m/s not 340.29m/s.

In any event a well stuffed ~2m line will give the desired result.
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harry h
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2005 6:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wonder how Harry came up with the folded line of 1.95m ...
For a B110 TL, 1/4 of wavelenght is a little bit more, isn't it?[/quote]

You are right, 1/4 wavelength is a bit longer, but as you stuff the line, the speed of sound thru the line decreases thus appearing to make the line longer. 1.95m stuffed at 1/2 lb per cubic foot with long fibre wool will work out about right.
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aspe
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 21, 2006 1:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Question - any B110 expert who knows?
Four B110, model SP1003s, are for sale - does anybody recognize this model "s"?
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ColinR
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 21, 2006 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Four B110, model SP1003s


That's either a typo or a grammatical error in the advert.

If they are <£20 to ~£25 a piece grab them!

If it's the four for "£200 Buy Now" that Google shows; RUN!

I thought Turkey stuffing season was over Very Happy .
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aspe
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2006 12:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Colin, you seems always there to help!
I've asked for a photo, the tag corresponds to £88 for all four (they are for sale in Sweden: http://www.hifimagasinet.com/annonsDetalj.asp?annonsID=2101)
(I can get 2xPeerless KO10dt for additional £30 if I want)

The "s" is not mentioned there but in a mail reply conc. conditions.
They are used in speakers and are said to be equal.

I've also bought a pair of Coda () arriving soon ...

I can't stop thinking of building a pair of 2-way Daline principle with 2xB110 fitted ..., I would like to try a TL and Daline seems to be kind of variant?
Wonder which tweeter to be prefered, T27 or something else.
If I will build the Daline type, probably I need some help to re-design it for 2 B110.
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ColinR
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2006 12:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very Happy

Only add the (rather good) Peerless KO10DT's if you want to add some Coles 4001G's too.

The KO10DT is a younger sibling of the DT10HFC used in mk1 Monitor Audio (MA1, MA4 & MA6) and mk1 IMF designs (ALS40, TLS50, Super Compact).

Treat it like a KEF T15 and pad down it's output with a few extra Ohms resistance.
Add the Coles and you get a "softer" equivalent of the Spendor and B&W GEC/Celestion HF1300/Coles combination.
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aspe
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are picts of the four B110 units for sale - any comments?
Would £88 be a reasonable price for them?
http://82.182.112.164/b110/kefpict1.jpg
http://82.182.112.164/b110/kefpict2.jpg
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ColinR
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 04, 2006 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

They look like and honest quartet, "recovered" from KEF Concertos no doubt.
With no evidence of the cone finish parting from the moulding (white bubbles), the condition is good.
Although the left side of the upper right unit looks "interesting" when you use the "zoom" function on your browser, so ask about it!

If I were in the market for them I’d start at –10% £80 and move up to £85.
Don't be too phased by the recent ePay prices of £14 to £20 each for such older units; it’s the availability of four that matters.
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aspe
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2006 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi again!
I'll soon be owner of four B110 SP1003 ... , will cost me about £85 incl. delivery ...
Would they be good/better/easier to comb. with tweeter Scan-Speak D2905/9500 instead of KEF T27 6535?

The D2905 seems to be a really good tweeter and it could be used with a lower x-over freq. (2500 Hz).

My idea is to build a TMM (?) TL speaker set, either Daline principle or a 1/4-line TL (which to be prefered?)

I have to rely on information/help I can get in ST forum or elsewhere on the net (I will only have my ears and a RCL multimeter as help ...)

(I will probably bother with lots of "rudiment" q-tions to have a design cleared before building - which then will take some time ...)

I hope I'll not end up with feets in deep shit ...
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