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Project with T27, B110 and B139

 
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Wouter
Intermediate Contributor 50+


Joined: 18 Jun 2004
Posts: 60
Location: Ramsel (Belgium)

PostPosted: Mon Aug 30, 2004 8:07 pm    Post subject: Project with T27, B110 and B139 Reply with quote

Hello,

I recently bought me a kit of B139-B110-T27. And now I am looking for an interesting project...
I hereby have some questions, maybe some of you have interesting advice for me....

-Are there any plans of the original Concerto available? I could also do some measurements on my fathers' Concerto's...
-Maybe another enclosure is better suited for these units: TL (I have a preference for these ones), closed cabinet, pyramid,...?

-I have the existing (standard) Concerto crossovers. I have read many times before that changing the filter could improve the performance of these speakers enormously. I have the choice of the Wilmslow ones. But does anyone have experience of building them yourself? Are there plans available of how to make better crossovers?
Note: I have the B139-6171 and not the SP1044. I don’t know if this has influence on the crossover specifications…?

-T27: I have both SP1032 and the older ones A6340. Which are the best? When my speakers are finished, I have the opportunity to test the differences, but anyone already an idea?


Thanks a lot to all the members who could provide me with tips!!!
If someone could send me something via the traditional post (copies), I will pay the costs.

Best regards,
Wouter
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terry
Senior Contributor 200+


Joined: 22 Apr 2003
Posts: 262
Location: UK

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 8:56 am    Post subject: Re: Project with T27, B110 and B139 Reply with quote

Wouter wrote:
Are there any plans of the original Concerto available?


Wouter
The Kef KIt 3 is the DIY Concerto. Plans are on this site if you are interested.
Terry
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Wouter
Intermediate Contributor 50+


Joined: 18 Jun 2004
Posts: 60
Location: Ramsel (Belgium)

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Terry,

Yes, I have seen the documents 'Assembling KefKit3' I suppose you mean these?
There are no measurements of the front panel, but I can measure these on a Concerto of my father. That's no problem.
But probably, it is maybe better to design the 'Sattellite' construction as you suggested...
But these are closed designs. Do you think this might be better for the B139? I remember most of the designs are reflex or TL loaded...
Only the CS7 was a closed design. In d-the spec sheets, Kef advises to use a reflex 62l cabinet.


Best regards,
Wouter
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terry
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Joined: 22 Apr 2003
Posts: 262
Location: UK

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 12:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wouter wrote:
Yes, I have seen the documents 'Assembling KefKit3' I suppose you mean these?


Yes that is correct.

Wouter wrote:
There are no measurements of the front panel, but I can measure these on a Concerto of my father.


The measurements are there on p3. The baffle board fits over the battens which are fixed to the two sides, top and bottom. The baffle board is the whole front of the box except of course for the thickness of the sides, top and bottom. The Concerto has different dimensions and so don't use that. The overall box size is flexible. See p2 of the document on the site.

Wouter wrote:
But probably, it is maybe better to design the 'Sattellite' construction as you suggested...
But these are closed designs. Do you think this might be better for the B139? I remember most of the designs are reflex or TL loaded...
Only the CS7 was a closed design. In d-the spec sheets, Kef advises to use a reflex 62l cabinet.


I think that I would use the dimensions supplied for the KK3 but have the B139 as the only drive unit in that reflex box. The B110 and the T27 would be in a separate vibration isolated box. Just my thoughts though. Perhaps others would not agree.

Best wishes

Terry
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Wouter
Intermediate Contributor 50+


Joined: 18 Jun 2004
Posts: 60
Location: Ramsel (Belgium)

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 1:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Terry,

Yes, separate cabinets, that seems to be a good idea.
The only thing missing are the length and diameter of the reflex pipe (as this one is integrated in the standard prepared baffle.
They write indeed that the internal volume can vary from 60-150l. But I always thought that the reflex pipe had to be tuned in association with the internal volume? Now, I can always do some test with the pipe length and diameter during the test phase...

I am also considering a sand-filled base for the cabinets.


Best regards,
Wouter
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terry
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Joined: 22 Apr 2003
Posts: 262
Location: UK

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 1:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wouter
I can provide details of pipe for KK3 if necessary but it involves taking a speaker apart first. If you are stuck I will however do that.
Best wishes
Terry
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Wouter
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Joined: 18 Jun 2004
Posts: 60
Location: Ramsel (Belgium)

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 2:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many thanks for your help, Terry.
I think I will get out of this situation. I will do some tests with the length and diameter after the cabinets are nearly finished (I hope at the end of the year...).


All the best,
Wouter
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terry
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Joined: 22 Apr 2003
Posts: 262
Location: UK

PostPosted: Wed Sep 01, 2004 10:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wouter
I believe that Colin Royle has been in touch with you regarding the details of the reflex pipe. He tells me that it is 6" long and has an internal diameter of 3&3/8". Thanks to Colin - I won't have to open my speakers now. Very Happy
Best wishes
Terry
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Wouter
Intermediate Contributor 50+


Joined: 18 Jun 2004
Posts: 60
Location: Ramsel (Belgium)

PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2004 4:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Correct Terry,

Colin told me that the length is 6 and the diameter 3,375.
Later on, he gave me more interesting information, here you have it:

"
Right Wouter the port is tuned to the cabinet voulme, so as you rightly
state bigger box shorten the length of the port to get the same resonnant
frequency. However if you follow German hi-fi consrtuction techniques build
a CS7 box and put a 6*3.375" port in it you get an extra 8-10Hz at the bottom
end. Might be lumpy but you get the bass extension. A long time ago you
used to be able to get telescopic reflex ports so that you could tune the
box on the run as it were, try and seek one out and consider 6th order boxes
- reflex ports filled with drinking straws ala Celef. Proac & Meridian.
Regards Colin
"

Voila, I know what to do now...
I will do some research on the internet on the topics, Colin mentioned and this will make me more wiser again!

To both of you: many, many thanks!!! Embarassed

Kind regards,
Wouter
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terry
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Joined: 22 Apr 2003
Posts: 262
Location: UK

PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2004 9:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wouter
I am pleased we have been of assistance. Colin has a wealth of interesting information available. You can see how often his name is mentioned on the site. We are in frequent communication.
Terry
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Wouter
Intermediate Contributor 50+


Joined: 18 Jun 2004
Posts: 60
Location: Ramsel (Belgium)

PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 7:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello Terry,

I am started, making the drawings.
But do you have an idea if it matters if the port is a the back or front?
I prefer having the port at the end (not visible).
I thought that the only disadvantage was: to place them far enough from the wall; to avoid a boomy bass.
I will make a 90l enclosure.

Second: the damping. mostly, BAF is used. Even more: in the documents of the kit3, the damping material is placed in a roll and scroll shaped...
Is this really important to do it the same way? The dimensions of my cases will differ...
As far as I know, also glass wool is used by DIY'ers....
Is this a bad idea (I still have a roll of glass wool on my attic...)


Best wiches,
Wouter
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ColinR
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Joined: 31 Jul 2004
Posts: 1175
Location: Staffordshire

PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2004 8:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wouter look at page 2 of the CS7 leaflet in "documents" and divide your glass wool into 100mm and 50mm blocks as per drawing whilst wearing gloves, goggles and a dust mask.
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Bazoozoo
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Joined: 14 Jan 2005
Posts: 6
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada

PostPosted: Sat Jan 15, 2005 7:37 pm    Post subject: Tuning Concerto ( KK3 ) Reply with quote

Hi Wouter,
Maybe this is too late but I just saw your email - I have original KK3 instructions which state a duct length of 6 inches and a cross section of 9,6 sq. inches ( 3,5 inches diameter ).
Actually just made a post asking about bass reflex in CS7's - guess I have my answer.
Dennis
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Wouter
Intermediate Contributor 50+


Joined: 18 Jun 2004
Posts: 60
Location: Ramsel (Belgium)

PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 6:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello Dennis,

Yes indeed, I was already started.
Thanks anyway for your reply!!!

Best regards,
Wouter
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