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painting a b110
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qguy
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 3:00 am    Post subject: painting a b110 Reply with quote

Hi is it okay to paint the driver cone to even out the color ?
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proffski
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 1:13 pm    Post subject: Re: painting a b110 Reply with quote

NO! Exclamation Arrow NO!
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qguy
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 15, 2006 11:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WHY !!! WHY !!!
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proffski
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 12:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Several reasons... You will be adding mass to the B110, that in its simplest form will completely alter the characteristics of the transducer!

If you are lucky that is all it will do, but you also have the potential to ruin the driver by the solvents present in the paint. And or alter the characteristics even further.

Whatever it is you could do will completely alter the Thiele/Small parameters for the B110.
So, the end result is that the painted unit will NEVER match the KEF or the BBC characteristics required for the chosen batch of drivers.

End result? You will end up with a nice? looking loudspeaker which is no longer anything like a B110...

If the damping layer is delaminating from the cone then painting it will be of no use anyway. I may be wrong but the damping is a form of PVA possibly.
I'm sure that either Terry or Collin will put me right here.

Andy.
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qguy
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 12:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

proffski wrote:
Several reasons... You will be adding mass to the B110, that in its simplest form will completely alter the characteristics of the transducer!

This is true, but its a very very small amount of mass, the dirt in the cone may even be heavier Twisted Evil

If you are lucky that is all it will do, but you also have the potential to ruin the driver by the solvents present in the paint. And or alter the characteristics even further.

Will test first.. but where ???...hehehe if the damping layer is some form of plastic, then quick dry Enamel should work fine

Whatever it is you could do will completely alter the Thiele/Small parameters for the B110.
So, the end result is that the painted unit will NEVER match the KEF or the BBC characteristics required for the chosen batch of drivers.

End result? You will end up with a nice? looking loudspeaker which is no longer anything like a B110...

it would be a KEF B110 Mk 2 Twisted Evil as in ruined


If the damping layer is delaminating from the cone then painting it will be of no use anyway

yes its delaminating and the way it looks really bothers me

Andy.
[/i][/b]
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proffski
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 12:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You seem determined to kill an already dying B110.The change in the frequncy rtesponse will ensure that you will end up with a loudspeaker which is no longer a B110. If it has started delamintaing thenm it is too late anyway. The only ears you will be fooling are yours...!
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qguy
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 1:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have had the B110 since they were not delaminating and did not notice any audible difference from them, they are used as mid ranges. Although the audible difference could be there, its just not noticeble to me

proffski wrote:
You seem determined to kill an already dying B110.The change in the frequncy rtesponse will ensure that you will end up with a loudspeaker which is no longer a B110. If it has started delamintaing thenm it is too late anyway. The only ears you will be fooling are yours...!
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proffski
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 9:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ear Wax? Laughing
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ColinR
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The damping is a PVA solution to a recipe developed by Leak-Wharfedale when they were owned by Rank!
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proffski
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I once watched the damping being applied by hand at Naim Audio.
The accuracy/consistency the operators achieved from unit to unit was amazing!


Last edited by proffski on Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:52 pm; edited 1 time in total
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qguy
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i read something similar, an $$$$$$ loudspeaker manufacturer orders drivers from OEM and then applies damping to woofers by hand !!!

proffski wrote:
I once watched the damping being applied by hand at Naim Audio.
The accuracy the operators achieved from unit to unit was amazing!
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proffski
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 16, 2006 11:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok, now for a quick quiz.

When damping is applied to the cone it can be allowed to set with the cone facing either up or down. Once set both will sound different and measure different as well. WHY? Confused
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qguy
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 12:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

proffski wrote:
Ok, now for a quick quiz.

When damping is applied to the cone it can be allowed to set with the cone facing either up or down. Once set both will sound different and measure different as well. WHY? Confused



I will take a shot at this..

Upside down the damping will go towards the Suspension/Surround
Right side up damping will go towards the Dust cap

if spray paint, dries instantly so upside or right side up will not matter
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ColinR
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The only "safe" paint for loudspeaker cones was the matt black water based Walpamur aka Decorators Wallop.

Used by Cambridge Audio to paint the baffles and drivers of early R40's and 50's with 6535 and 139A units.
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Parts
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 17, 2006 11:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

applying dope to a driver like the b110 is usualy preferable with the speaker facing up , this will usualy stiffen the area around the dust cap which some would say is more important with regard to cone stiffness and drive ?

If you have a driver with a large stiff dust cap like say the later Goodmans magnum k 12" bass driver, then upside down will probably help stiffen the surround area resulting in a more piston like drive and less edge distortion under large cone excursions ?
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